The craft of broadband compliance: How to avoid review after review after review

On this episode of Connected Nation, we talk with an expert in broadband compliance about what to do in advance to avoid going through review after review after review.

Recommended links:

Alvarez and Marsal site

Transcript

Jessica Denson (00:07):

On this episode of Connected Nation, we begin our coverage from the Broadband Nation Expo that took place in Orlando, Florida. On this episode, I talk with an expert in broadband compliance about what to do in advance to avoid going through review after review, after review. I'm Jessica Denson, and this is Connected Nation. 

I am at the Broadband Nation Expo taking place in Orlando, Florida. And this is officially day two, sort of. There was sort, there was some panels yesterday, but I am now at our Connect Nations booth in exhibit Hall and Marc Powell, who is with Alvarez and Marcal, which is public sector Services, walked by our booth. And I of course, grabbed him and said, please talk to us. Welcome, Marc.

Marc Powell (00:57):

Thank you very much,

Jessica Denson (00:58):

<laugh>. How are you doing? Good. Good, good, good. Did you just get in today or yesterday?

Marc Powell (01:02):

Uh, no. I was, I was actually, um, uh, speaking on a panel yesterday. So

Jessica Denson (01:07):

What was the panel?

Marc Powell (01:08):

Uh, it was about the importance of collaboration, uh, in getting these projects done. It was pretty general topic, but, uh, I talked a lot about, uh, what, what I work a lot in, right? Which is collaborations between states and their sub awardees to make sure that, um, everything that they do is done according to the rules, right? Uhhuh, <affirmative> compliance, right. In simple terms, right? It's, it's, it's complicated. So,

Jessica Denson (01:36):

Yeah, it's very complicated. Now when, uh, things have really changed the broadband space. Not only, you know, there's, everybody hears about bead, but there's lots of different programs that are that fund broadband, and how do you keep up with all of that <laugh>?

Marc Powell (01:50):

So there, there's a lot of pro, uh, grams at fund broadband, uhhuh, but there are also a lot of, um, there's historical programs that are not completed yet. Um, there's a, uh, a lot that is changing, right? On a day-to-day, uh, basis, right? We've seen, right, the administration being very agile, Uhhuh <affirmative> in trying to simplify the rules and sometimes simplifying the rules. Uh, but this gets done very quickly, uh, and it's really, really fast changing. 

Uhhuh <affirmative>. Uh, there's also a lot of, uh, requirements, even if you have only one funding source, right? You have, you're, you're, you're an ISP, you're funded true, be or your state, and you're, you're funding your sub awardees. True? Be you still have to comply with two CFR 200 federal accounting rules. You have to comply with, uh, uh, bill America Act, with Buy America Act, with the Davis Bacon Labor Relations Act. 

You have to comply with national historical preservation, environmental preservation. You have to comply with federal rule, uh, with, uh, state rules on top of that in the state where you are operating, and sometimes there's local, uh, or county getting in the way as well, right? So it creates a big, uh, a big, call it a mess, right? <laugh> of complexity fair that you have to sort through

(03:13):

Uhhuh <affirmative>, if you're the state, you want to make sure that the way in which your sub awardees are transmitting the information to you, it's transmitted in the proper form to the federal government.

Jessica Denson (03:24):

Uhhuh <affirmative>,

Marc Powell (03:24):

If you are an ISP, you wanna make sure that the information you're transferring is also in the, the proper focus. What you don't want to happen on either side is, oh, it's not work. I can't reimburse you. We're not getting reimbursed. Oh, you're sitting on the cash, right? Your cash flow issue for three months, Uhhuh, while this back and forth is happening. That's problem number one, right? Uhhuh problem number two is, at some point in a year, the federal government doesn't audit and they say, oh, Mr. State or Mrs. States, you should not have been paid for this 'cause this was not compliant. 

We're gonna call back that money. Wow. And we're then, then you end up in dispute with the ISP. You don't want that either. Uhhuh <affirmative>, right? And then the third thing that you don't want to happen is three or four years, or five years down the road, the Inspector General Uhhuh, that's another thing in the federal government that comes in and does a full audit of their program, it always happens, right? They do a full audit, uhhuh, and then they claw back from the state, and then they claw back from the ISPs, uhhuh, or they litigate, right? God forbid, you never want to go there, right? So, yeah,

(04:33):

It's crazy to say, but essentially it's in your best interest to put all your dogs in a row to talk to each other, right. So that you understand what needs to be done, that everybody does it. Right. So

Jessica Denson (04:43):

The first time around.

Marc Powell (04:45):

Yeah. First time around. Exactly.

Jessica Denson (04:46):

So how do you feel that, I think it's easy for some ISPs, especially smaller ones, to either feel overwhelmed or like, this is, this is too much red tape, but is compliance necessary to make this

Marc Powell (04:59):

Work? Co compliance is essential. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And compliance is complicated. Right? Right. And I will say, if, if you are Verizon, right? Or if you are a large, I, I don't mean to Finger point Verizon, I have finger point. No, they have lot more people. Yes, they have a lot more people, right? 

And they've done this kind of work before, uh, and they have a compliance department, right? So it's okay for them. But if you have a lot of the ISPs that are getting funds now to be right, they're really small companies, right? They're a, typically, there's a CEO, there's a CFO, there's a chief council, they're Chief operating Officers, there's a head of procurement, and then there's a call center, uhhuh,

Jessica Denson (05:36):

Right?

Marc Powell (05:36):

And then there's a billing department, right? And, um, there's very little capacity to do this. I was talking to the CEO of one of those ISPs yesterday, and um, and, and, and, and she was telling me, um, yeah, we've got some RDO funds. We did it ourself. Man, that was right. <laugh>, and, yeah. Not exact words, but essentially that was the spirit of it. Uhhuh, <affirmative>. And, uh, and, and we can't do that now, right? We gotta figure out a better way. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. Um, my clients are the state. So I, I actually end up working a lot with the ISPs because sometimes I will, sometimes they will hire me,

Jessica Denson (06:15):

Uhhuh, <affirmative>,

Marc Powell (06:16):

Um, most often it's the states that hire me. Um, but making that connection, right? Because as opposed to going into this back and forth of, oh, you did wrong, you need to change it. Oh, I tried to change it. Oh, you're still wrong, right? It's just like, okay, let me help you. Ah,

Jessica Denson (06:31):

Uh,

Marc Powell (06:32):

This is what you need to do, right? And let's work together on this. We both win.

Jessica Denson (06:35):

So, so why do you do it? Do you, do you love the idea <laugh>? I mean, no one loves going through tons of red tape. I'm not saying that, but are you a detail oriented person? It's just something you enjoy

Marc Powell (06:46):

As a personality? Um, I am a, I am a, I'm a strategic person, uhhuh, right? And I'm more about making the work, right? Successful. Uh, I was very personally very active. So I, I, I started my career as a, as a strategy consultant, uhhuh, uh, for, for tech and telecom companies, um, about a third of the way, and I did myself, I've been doing this for 30 years. Wow. Right? About a third of the way, um, um, uh, I started to work with private equity that were investing in telecom towers, right? Uhhuh, <affirmative>. So, um, that was a big boom in the, in the early mid two thousands, right? In, in telecom tower investments from private equity infrastructure funds, uhhuh,

Jessica Denson (07:29):

<affirmative>.

Marc Powell (07:29):

Uh, and then lo and behold, I became an infrastructure person, right? So I started to work not only in telecom towers, but in toll roads and airports and rail and parking garages and energy infrastructure, just anything

Jessica Denson (07:44):

To do with the infrastructure.

Marc Powell (07:46):

And, and then it was all about the financing and the business model, right? What is the business model? How much money is it gonna make? How much money is it? How much is it gonna cost to bill? What's gonna be the operating cost? How can we finance that

Jessica Denson (07:58):

Uhhuh <affirmative>,

Marc Powell (07:58):

Right? And what is our role as a private equity investor? Uh, did that for, uh, for a good 10 years. And, um, and, and funny enough, about 10 years ago, the state, um, um, dots, department of transportation mm-hmm <affirmative>. Started to look at deploying the systems that you see today, right? Toll by plate and, um, intelligent transportation system,

Jessica Denson (08:23):

Uhhuh, <affirmative>.

Marc Powell (08:23):

So they needed fiber on their right of way. And, and I found myself as the rare guy who understood both the toll road world

Jessica Denson (08:31):

Wow.

Marc Powell (08:31):

As well as the fiber.

Jessica Denson (08:33):

That is a very unique set of

Marc Powell (08:34):

Skills, <laugh>, that is completely unique. So at that point, I became the go-to guy to consult to these dots, Uhhuh on these fiber deals, right? Ended up doing a lot of these big fiber investments, all of them under public private partnerships.

Jessica Denson (08:48):

Mm-hmm <affirmative>.

Marc Powell (08:49):

Or most of them. And, uh, and, and then from there, um, followed Red Wind, um, Alvarez and Marcel's, key set of skills is anything that touches money, right? Making sure that our, our, our history is a bankruptcy restructuring firm. So we were founded as a firm that got in when, um, when there was a bankruptcy

Jessica Denson (09:14):

Uhhuh,

Marc Powell (09:14):

And help like, save the company, right? Or save the investors right at the last minute. So what that means, right, is we're not about pretty slides, right? It means that we are about hands-on uhhuh and our work with governments is that hands-on work, right? And right now, it happens to be that this compliance, so I spend a lot of time on project finance. 

I spend a lot of time on procurement. I spend a lot of time on public-private partnerships in all infrastructure domains beyond broadband, right? But in broadband, the topic of the day, uh, we're about to enter this deployment phase of bead uhhuh, and compliance, I would say is the topic that is, uh, none on people's radar as much as it should be.

Jessica Denson (09:57):

Yeah.

Marc Powell (09:57):

So,

Jessica Denson (09:57):

Um, what do you think in the, I have so many questions. You, you work in the toll road world and the telecom world. Uh, I heard a lot of talk yesterday, uh, especially, um, from the Virginia, I believe, broadband association about railroad crossings and try or railroad lines and trying to lay fiber near railroads, how expensive they were making it.

Marc Powell (10:19):

Yeah.

Jessica Denson (10:19):

Um, what, what advice or what, what lessons have you learned with dealing with those types of things that are public, private, and how can you make them more successful?

Marc Powell (10:31):

Um, oh, that's a, that's, that is a big question, right? Yeah. It's

Jessica Denson (10:35):

A big question. Yeah.

Marc Powell (10:36):

<laugh>. So I would say that transparency is the biggest issue, right? So the, the key to structuring a public private partnership, um, in my mind, right? Mm-hmm <affirmative>. Is, um, we, we, when we do the work, we anchor this on financial modeling, right? Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And what the goal of the financial model is, is to really understand, um, from both sides what the costs are going to be, what the revenues are going to be, right? What the CapEx is going to be, what the opex is going to be, when that's gonna stage in, right? So getting that detailed kind of financial view, that's where all those problems are gonna appear.

Jessica Denson (11:24):

Uhhuh,

Marc Powell (11:24):

<affirmative>, right? So if I work with a public sector client, I will first, right? We'll do what's called a bid side model, right? Uhhuh, <affirmative>, a bid side model is let's do, right, in the absence of, um, of, of an actual proposal, let's create the model from the perspective of the provider that are gonna be doing what we want them to do, and let's understand what the pain points are going to be,

Jessica Denson (11:52):

Uhhuh,

Marc Powell (11:52):

And then let's see if we have capabilities right? To handle or to alleviate those pain points, right? And having the best capabilities deployed against the best, um, uh, the best pain points, right? From one side or the other is the recipe to success

Jessica Denson (12:07):

Uhhuh.

Marc Powell (12:08):

So that's what we do then mean it can be negotiated, right? It can be progressive, it can be something that, um, that is procured in a competitive procurement. When you do that, then, um, then once you have a, um, uh, a shortlisted bidder right? Or a partner that you've decided to work with, then you refine it, right? And then you, you take it to its conclusion. And the conclusion is once you have that solid financial understanding, by default, the operational understanding kind of follows, right? Uhhuh,

Jessica Denson (12:39):

<affirmative>.

Marc Powell (12:39):

So, so that's, that's how I would anchor it, right? Yep. Gotcha. It's a very financial view,

Jessica Denson (12:42):

I imagine. Yeah. And I've noticed that there's a thread looking at the foundation, looking at where you start

Marc Powell (12:49):

Yeah.

Jessica Denson (12:49):

And doing it right from the beginning rather than having to come back and do it multiple times,

Marc Powell (12:53):

<laugh>. Correct.

Jessica Denson (12:53):

Correct. Yes. I like that. Correct,

Marc Powell (12:55):

Correct,

Jessica Denson (12:55):

Correct. Um, so tell me a little bit more about the company itself, right? Uh, what, where are you guys based? Uh, where do you, who do you work with? Uh,

Marc Powell (13:03):

So, so Albert and Marcel, right? Um, we're, um, uh, I think we're 15,000 employees now, or we're approaching that. We've been growing extremely fast, right? Um, I don't have the statistics, but we were founded, um, uh, 40 years ago as a bankruptcy restructuring firm. Uhhuh <affirmative>. I think I said that before. Yeah. You mentioned, um, Lehman Brothers bankruptcy, I think was one of our seminal projects, right? Where, uh, the, our two founders, Tony Alvarez and Brian Marcel, uh, uh, basically sorted out, right? That issue, and I'm not familiar with the details, right? But

Jessica Denson (13:39):

How long have you been with the company?

Marc Powell (13:40):

I, I've, um, recently joined, I, I uhhuh, uh, I retired from my believer of employer, uh, I'm dating myself once again, <laugh>, uh, a year and a half ago. And

Jessica Denson (13:50):

You look forever young now.

Marc Powell (13:51):

Exactly.

Jessica Denson (13:52):

Yeah.

Marc Powell (13:52):

And I, I, I joined a and m at the time, uh, because it was, again, perfect fit, right? Uhhuh, <affirmative> with that, this financials. So, so the good thing with a and m right, is, uh, first it has a lot of guys like me that have gray hair on them, right? <laugh> and, uh, a

Jessica Denson (14:06):

Lot of experience,

Marc Powell (14:07):

Which means a lot of experience. Yeah. Right? Mm-hmm <affirmative>. Um, the second one, right, is because of, so what we do now, we're a general consulting firm, right? We do, we do strategy, right? We do, we work with private equity investors. We do, we work with, uh, all segments of industry. We work with governments. We're around the world.

Jessica Denson (14:25):

Mm-hmm <affirmative>.

Marc Powell (14:26):

Um, but, but, uh, we're really focused on action as opposed to slides, right? Yeah. On this, a lot of the big name competitors, um, that, uh, that we, um, that, that we face, which is, there's always a bias. I mean, it's always data driven because it's financially oriented, uhhuh, but it's always a bias to action as opposed to bias towards making something pretty. Do I do that now? We're always willing to step in Yeah. And make it work. Uh, and, and we'll step in and release strategic stuff, and we'll step in into really tactical stuff like we're doing with this compliance work.

Jessica Denson (15:04):

And if somebody wanted to contact you or learn more about the organization, where would they go?

Marc Powell (15:08):

So, um, there's a couple ways. Uh, there's the website

Jessica Denson (15:11):

Uhhuh,

Marc Powell (15:12):

And, uh,

Jessica Denson (15:12):

I'll include a link in the

Marc Powell (15:13):

Description of the, the podcast, but it's really complicated, right? Because Alvarez, uh, and Marcal is not the easiest. Uh, it's Alvarez and marcal.com. Uh, my personal number, uh, I can give at 9 1 7 2 2 7 8 1 3 5. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. Always happy. Text me, right? I'll be available. Or again, M Powell, POM, no space, no dot m Powell, P-O-W-E-L l@alvarezandmarcel.com.

Jessica Denson (15:41):

I'll include that in the description of the podcast. So to make it easy for you guys, our listeners, to get to it. Now, I always do this with everybody. I, I wanna know a little bit more about you. You mentioned your wife worked for the Opera <laugh>, correct? Correct. Talk about that.

Marc Powell (15:54):

Yeah. Yeah. No, uh, so, so if there's one thing about me, uh, I think it, it, um, I don't know what it says about me, but I am, um, I do, um, very different things. Mm-hmm <affirmative>. And I'm very, that's good. I'm very obsessive <laugh>, and I get, I relate <laugh>, I get bored relatively easily. I

Jessica Denson (16:12):

Relate <laugh>,

Marc Powell (16:13):

Right? Uh, so, um, in my life, right? I have, uh, been an avid scuba diver. I've been Wow. A serious amateur boxer. Uh, I've been a, uh, lifeguard and competitive swimmer. Um, and I've also been, uh, as a hobby, but a serious, uh, fine arts painter. Wow. And, uh, my current obsession now I live in Florida, is, uh, to sit on the beach <laugh> and read really long books that no one has ever read, but most people I've heard of. So I just read, um, the History of the Second World War by Winston Churchill in Seven Volumes.

Jessica Denson (16:55):

Oh. I lo I'm kind of obsessed with World War ii. That's really funny.

Marc Powell (16:58):

I, I read the Seven Volumes. Yeah. Right. Now, I, after that, I read a History of Europe in Nine Volume, the Penguin History of Europe, and now I am, uh, reading a history of ancient Egypt, right? Oh, and what these books I've read, right, remembrance of Things passed by Pros in French, I've read the Decline in Fall of the Roman Empire. What these all have in common is they're incredibly long <laugh>, and it takes a lot of patience to get

Jessica Denson (17:22):

There. Are you like, the longer the book, the better Right now? Right now,

Marc Powell (17:25):

Yeah. Yeah. That's what I do now. But I'm sure in the year it'll be very different.

Jessica Denson (17:29):

Right. So yeah. I, I, I relate. I

Marc Powell (17:31):

Know if I'll be climbing mountains or I don't know. That's cool.

Jessica Denson (17:34):

Yeah.

Marc Powell (17:34):

Yeah.

Jessica Denson (17:35):

Don't climb ever. My wife's

Marc Powell (17:36):

An artist,

Jessica Denson (17:36):

Right? Too many people have climbed

Marc Powell (17:38):

Everest. She's a theater person. She, uh, she's fantastic. She, um, um, she has been, uh, both a, a, a theater producer, um, a production manager that's cool. At the highest level, Uhhuh at New York City. And, uh, and, and then she became a cultural diplomat, right? So she was a diplomat for, uh, for, for, uh, Canada and Quebec

Jessica Denson (18:01):

In Oh, that's fascinating.

Marc Powell (18:02):

New York

Jessica Denson (18:02):

City around culture.

Marc Powell (18:03):

Right. So,

Jessica Denson (18:04):

Dip, uh, I've, I've watched that show, I've watched that show on Netflix called Diplomat, but I'm kind of fascinated with the idea

Marc Powell (18:10):

She was cultural at attache. So if you like, if you like war, the cultural at Attache, especially during the Cold War, was always a spy.

Jessica Denson (18:16):

Oh, she was

Marc Powell (18:17):

Not a spy. She was not a spy. She was not a spy, but she was, that was her title.

Jessica Denson (18:20):

<laugh>. I think it's fascinating the fact that you're, or you're speaking for another country to a country, but as people to each other.

Marc Powell (18:28):

Yeah. Well, I, I came, I mean, honestly, I, I, I came to the US as a student and, uh,

Jessica Denson (18:33):

Where are you from?

Marc Powell (18:33):

Uh, I am Canadian. Right. Uhhuh <affirmative>. Um, but I came as a student in, uh, Alain myself again, 1985. I've been here ever since. Right. So

Jessica Denson (18:40):

And you love the US then?

Marc Powell (18:42):

Yeah,

Jessica Denson (18:42):

Absolutely. Of course. Where all have you lived here?

Marc Powell (18:44):

Uh, New York City, uh, 30 years. Well, Boston, a couple years when I was, I love Boston in New York

Jessica Denson (18:49):

City. Yeah.

Marc Powell (18:49):

New York City. And, but I've been in Florida for the last six, seven years.

Jessica Denson (18:53):

Kicking your feet up reading those long books. Yeah. Well, is there anything that you think, um, here, here at the Broadband Nation Expo, two questions and I'll let you go, I promise. One, why are you here? What do you hope for?

Marc Powell (19:06):

So, so, um, I am, I'm hoping right, to connect with, uh, uh, players, right? Uh, in this space, uh, state broadband, Uhhuh, uh, offices, right. Other consultants like Connected Nation mm-hmm <affirmative>. Um, ISPs, right? Because, uh, I, I really believe that we have the secret sauce right on, on making, um, from a public sector perspective, right. That compliance work, right. Uhhuh, <affirmative>, and avoid all those pitfalls, right. That they're there if you don't do it right, it's complicated. If you have a system, it's not that complicated. Right? Uhhuh, it can be done. We can do that. Well, and yeah, I'm here to, uh, to, to, to beat that drum and, and to make contacts, right. And who knows, maybe Connected Nation and us, and even work together.

Jessica Denson (19:55):

That would be awesome. We can't close the digital divide without partners and working together. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. My CEO says that all the time. Exactly. Well, are there any final words you'd wanna leave? What do you want people to remember about your, what your, your work is?

Marc Powell (20:08):

Um, uh, I, my work is exciting, right? <laugh>, uh, despite, despite everything you hear about compliance, right? It's very exciting. So, yeah.

Jessica Denson (20:17):

Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Marc Powell. It's Marc with a C Alvarez, who's with Alvarez and Marcel Public Sector Services.

Marc Powell (20:24):

Thank you very much.

Jessica Denson (20:25):

Yeah. We'll continue our coverage from the Broadband Nation Expo on future episodes of Connected Nation. Until then, I'm Jessica Denson, and this is Connected Nation.