How the Choctaw Nation is leading the way on Tribal broadband

On today’s podcast, we’re talking with the Tribal Broadband Leader for the Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma.  

We’ll explore how one of the largest federally recognized tribes is tackling connectivity challenges, leading fiber initiatives, and shaping broadband policy for Tribal communities nationwide.

Coming Thursday, April 2, 2026:  register for the Virtual Town Hall Meeting 

Recommended links: 

Robert Griffin LinkedIn

Choctaw Nation LinkedIn

Choctaw Nation website

Fiber Broadband Association

Connected Nation Internet Exchange Points

You’re invited to join Connected Nation’s experts on Thursday, April 2 for a special virtual town hall meeting that explores what’s happening with high-speed internet across the country. Register here: bit.ly/BroadbandFutures

Transcript

Jessica Denson, Connected Nation (00:05):
This is Connected Nation, an award-winning podcast focused on all things broadband. From closing the digital divide to improving your internet speeds, we talk technology topics that impact all of us, our families, and our neighborhoods. On today's podcast, we're talking with the tribal broadband leader for the Choctaw Nation of Oklahohoma. We'll explore how one of the largest federally recognized tribes is tackling connectivity issues, leading fiber initiatives, and shaping broadband policy for tribal communities nationwide. I'm Jessica Denson, and this is Connected Nation. I'm Jessica Denson, and today my guest is Rob Griffin, tribal broadband leader for the Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma. Welcome, Rob. 

Robert Griffin, Tribal Broadband Leader for Choctaw Nation (00:51):
Hey, good afternoon, Jessica. Great to be here. 

Jessica Denson, Connected Nation (00:54):
<laugh> How are you doing? 

Robert Griffin, Tribal Broadband Leader for Choctaw Nation (00:56):
I'm doing great. Yeah, already a fast start to 26. 

Jessica Denson, Connected Nation (00:59):
I know, it's going, it's, it's already flying by. I can't believe we're into the second week of January at this recording. Um, let's, let's dive in. I, I, I like to begin every podcast a little bit about your background and, um, kind of so we can learn a little bit about you and who we're talking to, you know, so guess starting just like, okay, why does this guy know this stuff? Um, <laugh> so let's start with, um, the ch- your Choctaw affiliation. Tell us a little bit about the Choctaw Nation and where in Oklahoma that's located, I guess, and a little bit about your affiliation with the Choctaw Nation. 

Robert Griffin, Tribal Broadband Leader for Choctaw Nation (01:33):
I'm happy to. So, um, personally, um, my mom was a full-blooded Choctaw Indian from Southeastern Oklahoma and our, our family on that side came over on the Trail of Tears in 1832. And so, you know, we, we landed here and I have lots of family in Southeastern Oklahoma. I sometimes get to meet new family members that I didn't know <laugh> about, um, on a daily basis and that's, that's always great to connect to them. And, you know, I, I just very, very glad to be here as a Choctaw member and employee. I'm also a Marine Corps veteran. Um, so I'm able to kind of put it all together in, in some type of mixology to, to come up with the broadband solution in, in many cases. Um, you know, the, the, the nation itself, I mean, we're right there on the Texas and Arkansas border. We're 11,000 square miles and just to put that in a visual sense, it's about the size of Massachusetts in a big rectangle.

(02:41)
So, you know, 11,000 squares miles has lots of towns, um, cities, rivers, pine needles, <laugh> hiking passes, and then on the other half, it's just, you know, fly as a pancake. So you, you never know what you're gonna get when you go out and put internet in the ground. Um, you know, it, it's just the population's only about a quarter of a million people, and we've got about 41,000 members out there. Um, that's about 18%. But the thing that we try and do is just always live and work and provide for the community. So we're always engaging with everyone that's, that's there. Um, we're always trying to grow. The communities, our relationships are very strong, they're very deep. And so just a, a lot of just face-to-face conversations, you know, we, we like to connect on the internet, but we even like more to go out and see people face-to-face.

(03:39)
Um, you know, what's kind of interesting is that we have so many employees and members that are either running companies or if they're part of the nation, they're, you know, running for office and, and they're either a mayor or a council member. Um, they have lots of jobs within the community itself. And, and so when you're in a family community and you're focused on your culture and your faith, you're just embedded into providing the best things that you can for all the people that are there. 

Jessica Denson (04:13):
Uh, you, you, that, that's a huge ... There's so mu- I have so many follow-up questions <laugh> because that was a lot that you said there that was really fascinating and interesting. First off, uh, how would you really describe the Choctaw people? You, you kind of touched on it some, that there are multiple jobs, it's, the culture's very, is embedded, the faith is embedded, the, there's a one-on-one kind of, um, uh, love of, of people there. H- how would you describe the Choctaw people overall? 

Robert Griffin (04:44):
Yeah, and I mean, if you go to the website, you see the words faith, family, culture, and when you meet the Choctaw people, you just live it and you become a part of it. So for instance, you know, when you come to our headquarters or any of our facilities, you'll, you'll hear words like holotau, which means hello in Choctaw, Yakoke, thank you, and Chapiza Lachiki, which means until we see you again. And, you know, those are things that have become a part of our, our life and who we are. And I think, you know, one of the things that everybody has always tried to do in the past 10 years that I've seen, they go to these websites and they send in their, their swabs and they try and find out more about their history of where they came from. And at the nation, you know, we have a cultural center, so if you wanna know about, more about where you came from, you drive over to the cultural center, you find the experts, you see lots of engaging, um, type of presentations, um, a lot of technical information, a lot of stories being told, a lot of videos, and I think having that connection, um, just, just adds to the knowing who you are.

(06:03)
And so when you know the struggles that you've gone through as a tribal nation, as a people, that makes a lot of difference. And so you don't really question, you know, those kind of things about yourself. You know who you are and you know the type of person you are just based on the history of your family and what you've gone through. Um, the great thing about our, our nation is that we are a sovereign nation, we are a government, we have great leadership, our, our chief and, and throughout is always embodying how we put all of these principles into our life. And, and I mean, we do separate work from family, but, you know, in many cases, work is our family. Uh, we have hundreds of programs that help support our members. We have people dedicated to just helping our veterans that are out there.

(06:56)
We have children's programs, education, healthcare. I mean, all of those things, um, take a unique person to really kind of coordinate and juggle throughout. But the great thing is, you know, we have 13 and thou- 13,000 employees at the nation throughout. So there's always somebody that knows something about helping somebody. And I, I would say that, you know, being there to be a servant, to help other people is probably the biggest thing that I take away from being at the nation. 

Jessica Denson (07:30):
I think that's amazing. And I will echo, you said, um, you mentioned Ya- Yakoki. Am I saying that right? 

Robert Griffin (07:36):
Yakoki. Yes. 

Jessica Denson (07:37):
Yeah. I believe you were, you were, we were talking about setting up for this podcast, you would sign off with that every time you'd, uh, uh, and so sincerely or something it was Ya Cookie, right? Got it. Yeah, I loved it. It's, uh, it's good for, uh, it's good to learn. Um, which is, brings me to, let's, let's move into the, uh, broadband equation. You also touched on that. Um, I think that, um, do you find, why does it matter that, um, tribal nations, the Choctaw Nation, uh, is it just an outward thing or is it a two-way street when it comes to broadband? As in, not only do, does it help the world learn about, help you, the Choctaw Nation access the world's resources and that kind of thing, but is it also to help people understand the Choctaw Nation? So, and I guess my question is, how do you view it a- as the need for broadband within tribal nations, specifically the Choctaw Nation? 

Robert Griffin (08:36):
Sure. So Jessica, I can answer that in a couple of ways. Um, the first one is that since we are a larger tribal nation, we have a lot of sophistication the way our systems work on the technical side, and that's through a lot of trial and error, a lot of people putting a lot of work over the decades. And, you know, the things that we're successful at, we're willing to share that information with other tribal nations that are going through that type of growth, or are working to add more programs and, and, you know, applications to their, to their IT space. So that's one thing that I'm really proud of is that we can do that for other tribal nations. And of course in Oklahoma, we have other tribal nations that are pretty similar in size to us, so we can coordinate with those other tribal nations, and we also are a big supporter of Tribal Hub, which is the IT based tribal conversation.

(09:37)
And, you know, many times we're on panels across the country, we're talking about successes and challenges that we've overcome a- as a nation and things to look out for. And then, you know, even just recently, I had a tribal nation come over to go through our data center, to take a tour of our data center to see what we had in the space, what it looked like, how we put it together, considerations for weather, those kind of things so that they could go and take that information and review on how they're gonna build a solution for their data center. So, you know, there are a lot of things that we can, um, help other tribal nations engage with when we do this. And I think, you know, the, the other way to think about it is that when we do this, um, we are working in an open reservation format in Oklahoma, in the state of Oklahoma.

(10:29)
And that means that there are towns and communities and municipalities that are part of our reservations. And so we can even utilize our resources to help those municipalities. So for instance, uh, there was a town in far Southeastern Oklahoma called Broken Bow that wasn't incorporated and they, you know, strove to become incorporated because economic, you know, growth there was driving it to become a formalized town. So we stepped in and helped them formalize that process. We're helping with their, their water conservation effort and management. And so, you know, not only helping from, you know, contributions b- financially in the area, but also through our experience, we're able to help them grow their, their town and support them in that way. So, you know, we're, we're just embedded in the community itself. 

Jessica Denson (11:23):
I think that's wonderful. Um, and I've heard other stories of, you know, it's people that live around the, the reservations are part of their, you know, the conversation that res- some of the tribal nations are doing really great innovative things and it's affecting beyond those borders, so to speak. Um, uh, as, because they're not physical borders is why I said that. <laugh> Um, what are some unique needs though for, within the broadband space for the Choctaw Nation? Is it what you were talking about when it became, when, when you were saying that there's a lot of different geography or is it something more? 

Robert Griffin (12:02):
Um, I, I think it is a lot of the physical challenges. So on half of our reservation, we've got granite and we're having to, you know, figure out how to get expensive build outs through this type of environment and, you know, that's just the reason why there is no internet there today, but the reality is when people build their homes or they're in locations like that, um, you know, the services are there for other type of utilities and now it's needed that there's, should be internet services there as well. And so those are challenges that are, you know, common in places like Colorado and some other states that we've talked to them on how they're overcoming that. But, you know, always very difficult. And then, you know, on the other side, we have locations that have multiple ISPs either building out and, and, you know, it's a very competitive environment.

(12:59)
Now, kind of what's happened over the last 15 years or so is that there's been more, you know, type, type one, type two carriers come into the area that bring in the big long haul pipes that can reach the big data centers and the, and the other cities, and that has started to progress and get, um, more, more a- available to everyone out there. And, you know, what that middle mile infrastructure hasn't always been available, but now it's starting to become available. And then when you start to, you know, break off the traffic, the internet traffic so that it can be usable by these smaller towns and there's competitive pricing out there, that, that's when you start to see that growth in a town. And, you know, I, I remember driving through towns throughout Oklahoma. I, I've lived here my whole life. I grew up in Yukon just west of Oklahoma City and, you know, you would hear about these towns on, you know, the spring forecast.

(13:57)
They would tell you that a tornado's coming in or- mm-hmm. ... coming in that weekend or that Sunday afternoon. It was always Sunday afternoon for some reason. And you would hear about this little town and in college I worked at UPS, so I memorized all these small towns in Oklahoma, and then as an adult, I'm driving through and I, I see this town, and there's only a post office there, and it says the zip code on it, and there might be a few small houses. <laugh> And that's it. That's the whole town. And it's essentially gone, and that's what happens when you have lack of either utility services, economic capabilities, or opportunities, and in this case, broadband, because if you don't have broadband, the real estate companies won't come talk to you, there will be no build out, nobody is moving out of town, there's, you know, economic availability there, and so it just dies.

(14:50)
And, you know, those are the things that we're starting to see get counteracted. They're, we're starting to see growth in these small towns, and you're starting to see different things come into the areas, things like Bitcoin data centers, larger data centers, um, bigger companies starting to find remote locations. The area's getting more and more attractive, but, you know, people have to have a place to live and people won't move there unless they have affordable, reliable internet. So this just all really ties in together to everything that we're doing and what the other carriers are doing. My, 

Jessica Denson (15:24):
Uh, sister lives in Yukon, so it's funny that you brought up Yukon because she lives in a new development that, because Yukon, if you recall, was much smaller with Garth Brooks Boulevard and all that now it's, it's, it's blown up in the last few years. Yeah. So my sisters, I know exactly the area you're talking about. Um, being a sovereign nation, um, you know, everybody talks about BEAD and the state broadband offices and that type of thing. Is there a particular way you work with the state and federal offices when it comes to broadband expansion? Are you having conversations with them? Um, how does that work for you guys? 

Robert Griffin (16:03):
Um, I don't think it's really anything unique that we're doing in our conversation. You know, just the fact that we probably know somebody that knows them or we grew up with somebody that they grew up with. Um, on the Oklahoma broadband office, they've got a handful of, of tribal members for the different tribes in Oklahoma. So, you know, I think that they have good, you know, connections with the people out there that live on these reservations. And, you know, when you have that, it creates that affiliation, but I, I consider it just, um, very similar to how I treat everyone. If I have a question, I give them a text or a call, uh, they are very responsive in those efforts to, to help us understand the situation. Uh, I just think that in all these cases, we're, we're working with a lot of government systems, a lot of paperwork, a lot of, you know, people seeing everything that's going on.

(17:01)
There's lots of eyes and all the funding that's going out there. So it's great to have all the funding, but I think everything is always in preparation for an audit. So- <laugh> Yeah. You get money and you are starting to build out, you're gonna get audited for what you did throughout that process. And, and so I think just keeping all of that in mind on, on both sides because I always find that people, um, that work in all the government areas, I mean, they're, they're showing up and trying to get their job done as best as they can and, you know, it, the money is not coming directly out of their pocket, so they're not so concerned about that, you know, versus I've worked in some capitalistic, um, you know, corporate environments where it is coming out of somebody's pocket and so there's different oversight there.

(17:47)
So, you know, I think just crossing the T's, dotting the I's at all time, helping each other keep eyes on things, that's, that's the best way to do it. 

Jessica Denson (17:56):
So you, you kind of touched a little bit on some of the challenges with the, the, the granite and then some areas where they have multiple competitors and some don't. Uh, what are some opportunities and/or lessons learned along the way? Things that maybe surprised you as you've gone through this journey with connecting the Choctaw Nation? 

Robert Griffin (18:17):
Well, it's, it's a new one every day. So the- <laugh> Yeah. Yeah. There's a new situation here, um, where we have our reservation as the Choctaw Nation of Oklahohoma, but in the history, there are little areas that other tribal nations have portions of land and it could be a parcel, it could be several acres, it could be, you know, just some ownership of land along a river. And when you're building out broadband services and you're receiving government money, they wanna make sure that everybody's okay and that you're not disturbing the environment. So the environmental processes are always, um, very, I call them difficult. I mean, for people in environmental studies, it's just standard operating practice, but for me, it's, okay, I need to go find out if we're disturbing a group of beetles or bats or something like that. And I have to think about that.

(19:15)
And, you know, I have to reroute fiber op- fiber optic network infrastructure that there might only be one road coming into the area and I gotta figure out now how to, you know, alter that route and then how much is that gonna cost to do that? And so those are things that you don't really think about because when you build fiber optic infrastructure into an area that doesn't really have a lot of roads and there's only one road and you have to change the route, how do you do that? Um, so you have to get creative, you have to, you know, work with other tribal nations. Sometimes you will consult them to d- directly, sometimes you hire an outside party to do that consulting. So there's just a lot of coordination and setting expectations. And I always have to ask a lot of questions that, okay, if I do this, then what happens and then am I talking to the right person?

(20:04)
And then I always leave with an open-ended question that, is there anything else that you can share with me? Is there anything else that you can think of? <laugh> We go through this process, do you think we'll get the approval or we'll be able to move it forward? Because sometimes, you know, people are not either, they're, they're probably just busy. They're trying to get through their day and there might be one little thing that they forget or something doesn't come up and all of a sudden you gotta start the process over or you gotta, you know, go back and it costs you a couple of weeks. And so it, it's just a lot of moving parts every day. 

Jessica Denson (20:38):
So does the Choctaw Nation, do you own your own ISP, um, or do you, is it that you work with the ISPs that are coming through? 

Robert Griffin (20:48):
Yes. <laugh> So we, we have our own, um, network infrastructure that we have built and, you know, we are not a tier one internet service provider. So we will go through service providers to get that internet connectivity and utilize some part of their network. So, you know, in this case, we might have some fiber optics in the ground, some equipment, network equipment, and then we connect to another service provider, that's pretty much standard operating practice across the world, right? So there's only a few one carriers these big data centers in the large cities. So everybody has to hop on usually somebody else's data centers. So we just follow the same system. We work with other carriers. On our reservation, there's about 15 and everybody's a different size, everybody's configured a little differently, and so we just continue to have those open access communications with them about where are you, you know, what do I need to do?

(21:52)
Um, we just had one last week about, okay, we're gonna build fiber here, how do we build it so that we connect with you? And I think on the opposite side, when carriers build fibers, if they will reach out to a Tribal Nation and say, "Hey, Tribal Nation, we're building fiber here, where are you at? Where's a good common point that we could meet you at and provide service at some point?" I think those are always good conversations to have. 

Jessica Denson (22:17):
Yeah, at ConnectNation, we often talk about how this is such, the digital di- divide is such a huge issue and the, the need for infrastructure and all of that is so big that you really have to work together. You can't do it in a vacuum. Uh, what role does fiber play in future proofing? How, how important do you think that is for tribal infrastructure? 

Robert Griffin (22:37):
I always tell tribal nations and, and really any entity, get as much fiber in the ground as you can or, you know, fiber in the air, but just get fiber there because the capacity for having fiber access is completely beyond any other type of access and it's the only access that is scalable for the future. And if you do that, you know, maybe you can't get fiber all the way to the home today, but you can get it to a, a good fixed wireless tower. Um, if nothing else, you can get it in the area and then future build outs, somebody might come in and build off that fiber, but always get as much fiber in the ground because, you know, we know the applications that are coming. If you think about your, your phone, your smartphone, it runs applications that it couldn't run two or three years ago and, you know, you keep going further back, you have to get a new device all the time because your old device can't run the new applications anymore.

(23:44)
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And that would be to happen in the future. You'll, your connection, connection device will stop being able to run the applications, and that's why a lot of the things move to the cloud because of the applications run the cloud. Well, these things always go back and forth. So at some point, you know, as we put more data centers in the ground, there's more peering points around the nation, then you need to have better access locally. If you end up just connecting with your cell phone device forever, you will be left behind and you won't ever be able to catch up. Now, you could always replace a device, but it's the learning that goes along with that. And we know, kind of back to my first statement, that, those applications are coming, and those applications are gonna come very fast. They're gonna be coming at such a high rate of speed in the next five, 10, 15 years.

(24:43)
It will be very difficult for, to keep up. And so, you know, if you have areas that you have specialized learning in, you wanna focus in on that, if you have areas of interest, you stay with that. But, you know, at some point, you, you won't be able to keep up with everything anymore. And most people don't anyway today. 

Jessica Denson (25:01):
Is that part of why you're part of the Fiber Broadband Association? Can you talk about that organization and tell us what the tribal community, committee's role ... I can't, I can't say that word for some reason. Why the tribal committee's role is within that larger association? 

Robert Griffin (25:18):
Absolutely. So I have a couple of thoughts there. You know, one, you, you heard how committed I am to getting fiber in the ground and the reasons why. And so that gives me a little bit of a platform to communicate that, but, you know, I, I think Fiber Everywhere is, is what we'd love to have, but we know the realistic part of that. And so the realistic part of that are the areas that tribal nations have in many cases that you will have to have a fixed wireless access somewhere or some other type of connection. And, you know, what we try and do is, you know, what I try and do as the co-chair is make sure any tribal nation that is a member has access to the information for their tribal nation. So if they wanna look at comparison charts or read a white paper or find somebody to talk to if they wanna learn more about AI, if, if they just have an area of interest that FBA has available, I wanna make sure that they're connected.

(26:25)
And, you know, for us as a tribal nation, there are things that are always coming up in, in the government side. There's different policies, there's different, you know, entities that we deal with sometimes. We work with the, you know, FCC a lot, NTIA, USDA, I mean, all the government entities, and not, you know, not all the carriers do that, not all of the, um, vendors do that as well. So it's pr- that's something unique to tribal nations. So with FBA, we get a lot of support from Gary and the team and all the people there of how can they serve us in a way that we get access to all that information, whatever it is that we need. And I think that's really important because when you're on a location in the middle of Utah or, you know, one of these other remote locations, you're not, you might not be seeing this on a regular basis.

(27:19)
You might not be seeing the latest information or data on whatever this topic is. And if you can join a committee like the tribal committee or a marketing committee or an AI committee, then you're, you're getting all of the leaders in the United States to be able to help you understand and give you access to that information. I mean, that, that's unique. That's just something that doesn't occur out there everywhere. 

Jessica Denson (27:43):
Yeah, that agreed. And it is sometimes you're, you're surprised by what's happening in Washington no matter the administration, any administration, whichever way you are, is sometimes you get sideswiped. Uh, what are, are there some things that you're watching right now that you're really interested in on that, on that level? 

Robert Griffin (28:03):
Oh, that, that's a great question, Jessica, because it is really hard to see everything that's going on all the time. And, you know, I have a couple of things that I'm focusing on this year. Uh, the first one is AI and, you know, it's very odd, right? Everybody wants to talk about AI. Yeah. So, you know, then it becomes so broad, it's like, okay, well, how does that help a tribal nation? And the thing that I've seen that is helpful for tribal nations is that we have very old processes and old applications and ways that we manage things. And if you think about it, a lot of managed projects go through the regular process of sending an email, using the Excel spreadsheet, you know, document comes here, it needs to get shared, but I think with AI, there's ways to consolidate all that information and, and keep it intact, and then you can start to develop processes using AI, and they be- they become standard operating procedures for your organization.

(29:08)
Now, that is extremely key in tribal nations. One, because since tribal nations are government, there's a lot of elected leaders that run the organization, and if a new leader comes into play and there's a complete change out sometimes in tribal nations with all of the leadership, and if there's no information, if there's no documentation, if there's nothing that's automated in any way, then a lot of times those projects get stopped because you don't have the intellectual capital there that was working with that project for somebody to come in and take over and run it. So what happens is then projects stop, then sometimes they go away and that's not a good thing, and there's no really, um, good documentation on, on the information. And so I think AI can go a long ways towards keeping all of this information documented in a format for internet service providers, for telecommunications, for engineering, for all these areas, and then, you know, if, if a tribal nation ever got to that situation, then they could transfer that data information over into a way that the project can be continued.

(30:17)
So that, that's one thing I'm really trying to pay attention to and try and get a good story around. And I think the second thing is, um, something that Connected Nation does is, is the IXP conversation because when you have all of this traffic moving around at, at such a fast rate, and we know that the rate of growth is very high, I think it's Moore's Law, right? Thatming at that very high rate and pretty soon you could, you could come into an issue of having congested traffic. Well, you know, with priority of traffic being set so that, you know, governments, hospitals, all these important entities that run our, our lives, they're gonna get the priority traffic. And if you're just working at home, your traffic becomes non-priority. Well, if you have IXPs in place and you have point-to-point peering with other, you know, complete carriers in, in place that create this mesh network throughout the world, then you don't have that issue.

(31:21)
But, you know, we're very much a society that we only deal with something when it becomes a situation. Yeah. And, and building IXPs like the one that just went up in Wichita, you know, building those IXPs are proactive. And so I think that's a really tough, um, sale. I think that's a tough conversation, but it also takes a lot of different people working in a lot of different ways to make that work. 

Jessica Denson (31:52):
Yeah, just for the benefit of our audience, IXPCNs for Internet Exchange Point, and it's generally a place where traffic, your Netflix, everybody can exchange information and then go back out to, to people. So if I send an email, it has to go to an internet exchange point and come back. But that's, that's a simplistic way to say it. But most places, most, mostly across the country, they're all in large cities. So any mid-size, small, rural area has to go hundreds and hundreds, if not thousands of miles and come all the way back. So you end up with this huge latency problem. So yeah, we're glad you brought that up. I'll include a link to that first so people can under- to the Wichita one that you're meas- that you mentioned. So w- was there anything else you wanted to bring up since I, uh, you said one, two, was there a third? 

Robert Griffin (32:39):
I think that'll keep me busy. Um- 

Jessica Denson (32:41):
Yeah, I think that will. <laugh> 

Robert Griffin (32:44):
I'm paying attention to, but yeah, that'll keep me busy. 

Jessica Denson (32:46):
So what's next for, next in your mind for the Choctaw Nation's broadband strategy? I know you, you said you wanna work, look at the, the AI and the IXP sides of things. Is, is, are those two the, the main focus for your strategy moving forward for the Choctaw Nation or are there other things you're looking at? 

Robert Griffin (33:04):
I, you know, always have several things that come up. Um, you know, our, our leadership drives the conversation and, you know, right now it's the, you know, keeping our culture as intact as possible and we do that through our language preservation. And so, you know, when I come across things that I think are really important for doing that, I always make sure that we're, we're paying attention. And so just even that thought of, okay, if I have a tribal home and I'm able to make sure that it has access for a device that help, will help with language or cultural type of connection, you know, those are the kind of things that I'm, I'm starting to think about. And so, you know, if you go to an airport, you have this big LC, LED, LCD device that you can touch and, and you can go through.

(34:02)
And we have a lot of those in large companies and different places that you go, but, you know, for example, if you could have one in your house that you could scan all the Choctaw programs or- Oh, yeah. ... a while from the past or look at your org chart or history, you know, something that is unique to you as a member of the nation, I mean, those are, those are things that I'm thinking about. So where you have to go is putting that into that conversation upfront when other things are being done and being built. And so the scalable factor is always there that, okay, if we provide an access connection to this location, make sure that we account for that, or we think about that when we're building it. And sometimes it's more of a mechanical thing. Um, I'm always a, a, a very big proponent of being proactive, preparing, making sure that, okay, if we're gonna do this, you know, let's make sure we think about what's gonna happen in the next five years at this location.

(35:04)
Um, so for instance, when we build fiber optic construction routes, we like to know what's gonna happen in this area in the next five to 10 years. Maybe next year there's a building going there or, you know, a bank is starting to grow and they're looking at that location. So we reach out and try and find out, okay, or is anybody building in this area? Does anybody need to build in this area? Because when I build that network, I wanna put a handhole pretty close to it so it doesn't cost a lot of money to come back and provide fiber service to that location. I wanna make sure that I have different routes coming in. So if it's a high priority location that potentially we're looking at putting a hospital or some other, um, you know, type of facility that needs dedicated internet connections that I have dual routes coming into the area.

(35:52)
So, you know, kind of looking at the overall Choctaw network, looking at other people's networks that are here, kind of thinking through the strategy. Now, that's something, um, we've been working on for over a decade now, and it, it has continued to get better and better over time, but there's always ways to improve in that area. 

Jessica Denson (36:11):
Uh, I love the idea of having something inside your home that you could really connect to your culture with. That's, that sounds super cool. And you really <laugh> now, uh, hit the nail on the head with the need for better connection with hospitals, especially in any place that has any rural parts to it. Right now, that's a, that's a big problem with a lot of s- of hospitals closing in rural areas. Having access is gonna be so critical. Um, just my two cents <laugh>. Um, uh, Rob, what's the one key takeaway you want our audience to remember about tribal broadband and the work that you're doing specifically with the Choctaw Nation of Oklahohoma? 

Robert Griffin (36:52):
Well, a couple things. Um, you know, I, I think I, I would like to take the information we're talking about today and formalize it in, in a, in a, you know, format people can have access to. So I'm writing a book for tribal broadband in 26. I'm gonna interview several tribal broadband leaders like myself across the country. I'm gonna take a lot of the data and unique situations and put it in a format that people can see and, and continue to learn more about. And that's really the important part of that is I tell people all the time, if you're near a tribal nation or you're traveling and you can find a way to go find out more about a tribal nation, then do so. You know, if you're going through an area that has a cultural museum or a tribal nation that might have a facility there or, you know, it's kind of like just going to, to Paris, right?

(37:44)
You know- mm-hmm. ... I've gotta learn we're going this spring, I've gotta find out more about the French language, where I'm going, what's around there, all the things that I wanna see. Now, not all tribal nations are, you know, like Paris where you have a nifel tower or something like that, but I found many tribal nations that you go there, there's a cultural center, you find out a lot about historical items, historical events that happen in that local area. Um, and I mean, those are things that are very much worth your time and energy and effort. And it might be as little as five minutes. You stop at a little place on the roadside and there's a sign there, it tells the history of the location and what happened in that location. Um, sometimes it's just a building and then, you know, all the tribal nations are unique.

(38:31)
They've all come together across this big, vast country of ours and they've been moved in the last 100 years, couple hundred years. And so the tribal nation got there somehow. How did they get there? And I think the story of trying to find out more about that is always worth, worthy of your time. So you can always go to websites and find out more. You can go to the BIA website, www.bia.gov. You can pull up the tribal nation if you, it has people's telephone numbers or email addresses. Um, I think tribal nations, if you reach out to them and just have a conversation, very many cases, they're very open to you coming and talking to them. Now, if they're not, of course, you know, just respect their privacy and, and, you know, just kind of keep that in mind. But, hey, reach out. We tell tribal na- to corporate America to reach out all the time to tribal nations.

(39:27)
Get involved. If you're building, if you're a customer, if you're, you know, in the area, just find out what's happening there and see if there's a conversation that could be had. 

Jessica Denson (39:37):
Yeah. And I could attest growing up in Texas and Oklahoma that there are some really amazing things to learn from native tribes, um, and their history and their, um, and just the, the amazing stuff about your language, the people, everything. So I would encourage that as well. Also, writing a book, you buried the lead, Rob. <laugh> I had no idea. When that comes out, you need to come back on and talk about it. I, we would love to have you. 

Robert Griffin (40:05):
Oh, uh, I would be happy to, to join back in. Now, you know, I kind of do it in the sense I've started it and now I've said it, so now I have to do it <laugh>, right? Put it out 

Jessica Denson (40:15):
There, 

Robert Griffin (40:15):
Yeah. <laugh> 

Jessica Denson (40:17):
Well, I really appreciate your time today. I've enjoyed talking with you so much. And, um, again, we're gonna follow up when that book comes out, so I'm looking forward to that. 

Robert Griffin (40:27):
That's great. Thank you, Jessica. Yako Key. 

Jessica Denson (40:30):
Yako Key. I love that. I feel like that's something special that I've learned. Uh, again, we've been talking with Robert Griffin, tribal broadband leader for the Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma. I'll include a link to the Choctaw Nation website, among other helpful links in the description of this podcast. Again, I am Jessica Denson. Thanks for listening to Connect to Nation. If you like our show and wanna know more about us, head to connecton.org or look for the latest episodes on your favorite podcast platform.