Going the second mile: How a women‑founded RevOps firm is transforming ISPs

On today’s podcast, we’re diving into the world of digital transformation, RevOps, and how ISPs can streamline operations from customer service to infrastructure. 

We’re talking with leadership from one company working across North America and beyond — helping organizations connect their systems, automate workflows, and build the future of operational efficiency.

Recommended links: 

Second Mile website

Hannah Collins LinkedIn

Second Mile blog (RevOps, HubSpot, Integrations)

Transcript

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Jessica Denson, Connected Nation (00:08):
This is Connect to Nation, an award-winning podcast focused on all things broadband. From closing the digital divide to improving your internet speeds, we talk technology topics that impact all of us, our families, and our neighborhoods. On today's podcast, we're diving into the world of digital transformation, rev ops, and how ISPs can streamline operations from customer service to infrastructure. We're talking with leadership from one company working across North America and beyond, helping organizations connect their systems, automate workflows, and build the future of operational efficiency. I'm Jessica Denson, and this is Connected Nation. I'm Jessica Denson, and today my guest is Hannah Collins, the co-founder and vice president of growth for Second Mile, a women-founded global tech and rev ops consulting firm serving ISPs, higher education, and mission-driven organizations. Welcome, Hannah. 

Hannah Collins, Second Mile (01:10):
Hey, Jessica. Thanks for having me. It's great to be here. 

Jessica Denson, Connected Nation (01:12):
Yeah, it's good to be here. Hey, uh, Hannah and I have had a little trouble getting aligned <laugh>. We've had this scheduled a couple of times. I had no internet, ironically, at one point <laugh> had to redo this, so I'm so glad we're finally talking. 

Hannah Collins, Second Mile (01:26):
Me too. Yeah, we've been star crossed, uh, but we're finally synced up. It's great. 

Jessica Denson, Connected Nation (01:31):
We really have. And now I've got storms on the head, on the, um, horizon, and I was worried about that, and now we're all good. But anyway, before we dive into the work you're doing now with Second Mile, I'd love to begin with your story. Um, you studied Spanish at the University of Tennessee, a background that deeply shaped, I would say, your communication style and career. But can you share how your language, language and cultural studies laid the foundation for entrepreneurship and beyond? 

Hannah Collins, Second Mile (02:01):
Yeah. I mean, being a Spanish major, uh, and then going into entrepreneurship, I would say is, is not the most direct path, but- <laugh> ... Uh, honestly, it, I'm, I'm so grateful for that background and that experience. Really, at the end of the day, being a Spanish major taught me how to communicate across different languages, across different cultures, uh, and honestly, really just meet people where they're at. Um, so you really have to get uncomfortable and, and stretch yourself, especially, uh, you know, maybe you don't exactly know the word for something and it, it's on the tip of your tongue. You can kind of, um, express yourself, uh, by talking around things. And that just made me really appreciate how m- valuable, clear, kind, direct communication is when you're, you're really at a loss for words as someone who's speaking another language. I'm learning another language right now, um, so I'm suffering again, but- <laugh> ... Yeah, just like- 

Jessica Denson (03:03):
What language this time? 

Hannah Collins (03:04):
Um, I'm learning German, so- 

Jessica Denson (03:06):
Oh, wow. 

Hannah Collins (03:07):
Yeah, really, uh, stretching myself out of my comfort zone. But yeah, I think there's so much value to learning new languages, being able to connect with people you would normally connect with. Um, and honestly, uh, every language, just the way that it's set up teaches you so much about the context of how people kind of function within that language. We have limitations in English, there's limitations in German. There's also amazing things you can express in other languages that, like, don't quite do it justice. And so, yeah, I'm so thankful for that background. 

Jessica Denson (03:41):
And you actually worked abroad as a translator in Nicaragua, Nicaragua. <laugh> I can't say it all of a sudden. Nickaragua and the DR, i.e. The Dominican Republic. Uh, what was that like? 

Hannah Collins (03:54):
Yeah, that, uh, so much fun. I really enjoyed, uh, that experience. So adventurous, I had no idea what I was doing, uh, but I was, yeah, a translator and a host for groups that would, uh, American groups that would come down and visit those countries. And that's really where I found this passion for, definitely for travel, um, and adventure, but also for connecting different people. And, you know, you have to kind of bridge the gap between two different cultures, two different languages, put yourself in one person's shoes, put yourself in another person's shoes to effectively communicate a message. And yeah, it, it sounds really silly, but it, that's kind of what marketing is, right? Like, you have a business- 

Jessica Denson (04:41):
Mm-hmm. 

Hannah Collins (04:42):
... that needs to communicate a message and you have a customer that has something that they need. And so you have to kind of be this translator to, to pass things back and forth. So, um, yeah, that, that experience, um, you know, there were times where I was, like, in the middle of the jungle, you know, no, no smartphone and you can't just, you know, look, Google translate something, kind of have to figure it out on your own. But yeah, it was a great time. 

Jessica Denson (05:08):
I, well, I love traveling and, um, uh, I've been to Ecuador and Egypt and things like that, so I totally get what you're saying, but also myself and, um, our, my partner in crime, Lily McCoy, who's on this, producing this podcast, uh, we both are in digital communications and marketing. And so we'd really love to hear <laugh> some of your key lessons from those early agency roles when you first, um, were working in this field. 

Hannah Collins (05:37):
Yeah. I remember when I got started, so I got started in, in marketing by creating a Twitter account that got pretty famous and I remember this is- What, what 

Jessica Denson (05:50):
Was it? What was the Twitter account? <laugh> Can you tell us? 

Hannah Collins (05:53):
Yeah, of course, of course. Uh, it's called Total Young Life Move. So I was involved with Young Life. I started this Twitter account. Nobody knew who was behind the Twitter account. Um, and this was back before a- you know, social media analytics. So I would be counting the number of, like, retweets and impressions and comments, uh, you know, and, and really s- you know, trying to figure out what worked, what didn't work, what messages were resonating, you know, what people were, were latching onto and what they were interested in. So yeah, that ... And I, I loved it. I was like, it's ki- it's this really fun blend of science and art and communication. And yeah, I got hooked and that's ultimately what got me into copywriting and starting to work at agencies. And, and this was really, really early days of social media. So being on the front end of that experience and, and, you know, at the tip of the bell curve and then seeing where we are now, uh- Oh. <laugh> 

(06:52)
... Very fun. Uh, but yeah, that was ... I think being an early adopter in that social media space and really embracing it instead of, you know, shying away from it, um, taught me a lot about being on, on the front end of things and not being afraid to experiment, not being afraid to try new things. 

Jessica Denson (07:11):
That, that's wonderful. Do you have any favorites that you think are doing it right, right now in that world? In 

Hannah Collins (07:17):
The 

Jessica Denson (07:17):
Social- Not necessarily just Twitter. Yeah, but just in the social media world. 

Hannah Collins (07:21):
I gotta say, I love corporate Natalie in the social media world. She has found a way to be funny on multiple platforms. Um, she found a way to be funny on LinkedIn and on Instagram, and I think those are two very different audiences. <laugh> Oh, yeah. Um, so really appreciate the content that she's putting out and enjoy that. Uh, yeah, she's doing a great job. 

Jessica Denson (07:46):
We'll definitely have to check her out. Well, uh, from there, you moved into co-founding Second Mile with your business partner, correct? 

Hannah Collins (07:54):
Yeah. Yeah. 

Jessica Denson (07:55):
Talk about that. What led to that, what brought you two together, what inspired you to start the company in? I, I have 2016, is that correct? 

Hannah Collins (08:04):
That's correct. So, yeah, we're going on 10 years. Wow. It's crazy

(08:08)
To think I have a 10-year-old on my hands. Uh, it's getting out of control, but yeah, time flies when you're having fun. And, and to think that we started 10 years ago, it's still kind of a, a pinch me moment. I'm also just so thankful after a lot has happened, you know, in the world in this past 10 years, so much gratitude to still have a business, uh, at l- especially a business in the digital space, the way that things have grown and evolved and changed. So really thankful that people have been trusting us for the past 10 years. And yeah, we met in college, my business partner, Jess and I, we met in college playing, uh, division one lacrosse at Jacksonville University. I got injured and the, and then ultimately transferred to UT. But during that time when we were ... Uh, you, you probably sense a trend here, we were the inaugural team.

(08:59)
So we, we founded, um, that division one program. And, uh, so Jess and I were, were both on defense. I was a goalie. She was a defender. And the amount of trust that you have to create between, you know, people on, on a sports team, let alone one that's doing it for the first time- mm-hmm. ... uh, we really saw each other win, we saw each other lose, we saw highs and lows, we saw each other, you know, sick after a hard workout. Um, you just have each other's back, like, through thick and thin. And I remember when we decided to start the business, Jess had an MBA, so she was more on the business side of things. I was more on, um, the social and creative side of things. And we were like, "What if we combined our forces and, and, you know, started working together on this?

(09:52)
" Um, you know, people were like, "Don't have a co-founder, you know, especially one that you're friends with. " But I gotta say, it's really served us well. Like she's so strong in areas that I'm not and vice versa, and it's allowed us to support each other in our personal lives as she's growing her family and, um, and as I've, you know, been able to have a, a digital nomad experience over the past couple of years. So, um, yeah, I'm just really grateful that we had such a bedrock of trust before doing something like start a business together that was, was the foundation and still, uh, guides those principles for how we run the business today. 

Jessica Denson (10:34):
Uh, you remind me that I was, uh, a recent guest with the podcast that's coming out later in April. Um, I was talking to him and he said one of the, the biggest mistakes people make is they don't pick people they can trust who fill a different gap that they don't, they don't fill. So it sounds like you started out doing the right thing right away, having someone you could trust and you both had different, um, skillsets, um, and it served you well, obviously, hitting 10 years. Uh, uh, let's not forget the, uh, I saw that, that the story behind the name was inspired by Chick-fil-A. <laugh> Is that, is that 

Hannah Collins (11:09):
True? It's true. Uh, that's how we got our start. So I have a Chick-fil-A background, um, and that was really how we started Second Mile. So in, in the Chick-fil-A world, it's called Second Mile Service. That's that Chick-fil-A experience you've come to know and love with the saying, "My pleasure walking you to your car when it's raining," um, you know, really those extra touches. And so when we started the business, we were like, we started as Second Mile Marketing, um, to speak primarily to that Chick-fil-A audience, but we, we are since out of, of the social media space and, uh, I know we'll, we'll touch on that in a little bit, but, um, our, our goal was to say, "Hey, you know, even if we're not working with Chick-fil-A's, we want people to know that we're gonna go above and beyond." Um, and, uh, really we've kind of embodied that to mean live generously.

(12:09)
So be generous with our time, be generous even with our assumptions, right? Like assuming the best intent of, you know, when you get that email, being like, "Hey, let me assume the best intent of the person who's writing this email and not jump to any conclusions and, um, really, yeah, be generous with the way that we treat each other." Um, so yeah, that for us is what going the second mile means and, um, yeah, I, now we're just second mile. We, we dropped the marketing, but very, uh, it, it's been a, a fun ride and I'm so glad that that ethos has, has carried us through over the past 10 years. 

Jessica Denson (12:49):
It's, it's such a simple idea, but something that's lacking in so many areas, I think in life, it can be easily, you can, you know, you misconstrue people, you misunderstand what they say, but to just assume that there are good intentions, I, I love that. Um, and you, you kinda, you were kind of heading that way, so let's go that way, uh, that Second Mile has evolved signif- significantly over the years. So talk about that evolution and what you're doing now. 

Hannah Collins (13:16):
Yeah. So we originally started off as a digital marketing agency, and, and we definitely still have a component of that, but as we were in the digital marketing space, we started to realize, you know, we can bring in really solid leads, uh, but, you know, if sales isn't closing leads, like what, the, they're just falling out of the back of the funnel, right? Everyone talks about the marketing funnel, you gotta fill the funnel, you gotta fill the funnel. Um, but what if the bottom of the funnel is empty and they're just pouring right back out? So we, we started getting involved in the sales process of, okay, so what happens once we bring in these leads? Like, where do they go? How is sales taking care of them? You know, what are, what ... And then once they become a customer, selfishly, as a marketing a- agency, we were like, "Well, we would love to upsell and cross sell those customers, but if we can't send them a marketing email if they have a customer support ticket out.

(14:10)
" So that's really how we started getting into revenue operations, RevOps, and saying, you know, marketing, sales and customer service all are, are part of a revenue engine, not just marketing and not just sales. Every single, you know, piece of that puzzle is all working up towards, uh, the revenue engine and, and growing the company, uh, long gone are the days where, you know, marketing and sales and, and service are- mm-hmm. ... are moving in different directions. Like they've really gotta be going towards the same place. Um, and so, yeah, that's how,

(14:45)
Uh, to be totally honest, getting into RevOps was selfish because we were like, "Hey, we're, we're bringing in leads, what's happening to them?" And, "Hey, we wanna market to more of, you know, of your customer base. How do we make sure that it's the right time and the right place to do that? " And so, yeah, it was kind of this natural evolution, um, to, to really sit at that intersection of all three of those, uh, teams and spaces. 

Jessica Denson (15:08):
If you could see me, I know we're doing, this is an audio podcast, I'm just nodding my head. Yeah, yeah. They're definitely all integrated and should be. And so your team now, what led to focus ... I know not just ISPs, you guys focus on, you focus on multiple, um, areas, but, uh, talk about the ISP portion and how you integrate systems across marketing, customer service, infrastructure. You know, what are some of the biggest chall- operational challenges that are specific to that industry? 

Hannah Collins (15:38):
Yeah, we love our ISPs. It has been ... I, I'm, I know you also can't see me. I'm, I'm totally nerding out over here. <laugh> It's been so fun to get in with our ISP customers. I think the thing that really inspires us with our ISPs is they have this kind of amazing vision and call to bring digital transformation specifically, you know, we're working with ... We do have customers all over, but we are really focused on our US and North American ISPs. And I think it's amazing this, this digital transformation, especially to rural communities and really, you know, elevating the digital experience for Americans. And so I get super excited to be able to do that for the ISPs themselves, right? They're, they're so focused on, "Hey, how do we, you know, bring and infuse technology into, you know, places in the US that have not had that type of experience?

(16:42)
How do we get fiber to some of the more remote and rural communities? How do we, you know, expand digital access?" And we kind of view our role as doing that within the ISP. So I think some of the biggest challenges is that, you know, a, a lot of ISPs are coming out of legacy telcos, they have legacy systems, um, or ... So that's one challenge. And these legacy systems don't talk to each other. Uh, and so how do we connect all of these different systems so that the data is flowing so that you can actually leverage that data and make strong decisions and be able to, you know, you have this gold mine of customer data. And so making sure that, that you're being a good steward of it and leveraging it on the one hand. And then for, you know, newer startup ISPs, they're growing so quickly, and so really making sure that they have the right technology in place that's not gonna limit them and be able to support that rapid growth in the future so that, you know, they are choosing tools and platforms and systems that are going to enhance growth instead of inhibit it.

(17:43)
So 

Jessica Denson (17:45):
Do you, do you do a lot of work with automation or what is it, what, what does it look like when they do it the right way? 

Hannah Collins (17:52):
Yeah. So I would say there's three things to be thinking about. Uh, it is this intersection of people, platform, and process. So you can have, you know, the best sales and marketing teams in the world, but if they don't have the right process or the right platform to support them, it's all gonna fall apart. Um, and so when we think about that intersection of people, platform and process, the other intersection that we're thinking about is, you know, everyone is, is says, "Yeah, I wanna automate things." Well, we can't automate anything unless we integrate it first. So- mm-hmm. ... even something as simple as filling out a form on your website, if that's not integrated with your CRM, how are you gonna automate that marketing email, right? Like that's, you know, the most basic example of it. But, you know, everyone's talking about automation and automation, AI, but it's like, "Hey, we gotta, we gotta take a step back and make sure that these systems can actually talk to each other." So integration is first, then automation comes second.

(18:49)
Um, and then after that, like, you know, to, to keep it going, that's when really you can hit, um, elevation and, and scale past that point. Um, when we're reducing these manual processes, this friction, um, that's kind of the, the next triangle to think about there. 

Jessica Denson (19:06):
So you brought up AI. Is it, is that a piece that you're looking at as you get these clients revved up with those first steps you talked about? 

Hannah Collins (19:16):
Yeah, definitely. Um, so, I mean, AI is powerful, um, but it also feels like we're at this, you know, similar point in time, uh, as we did with, uh, social media revolution. Um, you know, when, when that started to become a critical piece of technology that people were like, "Hey, this is, this is part of the digital ecosystem, it's time to embrace it. " You know, we're, we're at that space as well. So helping our customers understand, um, how to leverage AI and, and not just add it to the technology stack because they feel like they have to, but really being thoughtful about it is one piece. But, but again, to, to really back up and say, "Hey, the, you know, AI is great, but like if we don't have the right data sets in place, that AI is, is only going to be able to, you know, ma- analyze things based off of the data.

(20:09)
So we gotta make sure the data's clean. We gotta make sure that the, that there's a data architecture and a data system for, um, you know, how that information is getting processed. So AI is fantastic, but, you know, bad stuff in, bad stuff out, right? Um, so that's also, I would say we, we do a lot more on the foundational side of things of getting, you know, data architecture and data systems in place and then introducing AI instead of the other way around, um, because, yeah, what, you know, the joke is ... I remember when my mom first told me, "Hey, when you move into a house, you gotta clean your baseboards because you'll never do it again." <laugh> That's so true. And I'm like, I was like, "Mom, the, uh, you know, I was in college moving into my first house and she was like, we're gonna clean the baseboards." And I was like, "This is the worst." And now that is one, definitely the very first thing that I do anytime I move.

(21:01)
Um,

(21:02)
And two, the analogy that I like to use when it comes to AI of like, "Hey, first, let's clean these baseboards because, uh, that is one of these things under the surface that you don't realize it, but then, you know, the next thing you know, you look down and you're like, oh, this place is disgusting." <laugh> So, you know, like that's kind of the, what we do is make sure that the data is clean and then AI is so powerful, right? It can recognize these datasets, it can recognize these patterns, it can make these recommendations on, you know, untouched customer segments or how to better fine tune your marketing, um, but it has to understand a- and make sure that we're actually targeting the right people in the first place. 

Jessica Denson (21:44):
Uh, do you think that, you know, the, the top of the podcast, we talked a lot about, uh, the fact that you're breaking new ground, you're trying new things, going out of your comfort zone, um, again and again, is AI another place that because you've done that, you have a little bit of a com- you're comfortable trying those new things? 

Hannah Collins (22:04):
Yeah, I think so. You know, as we were talking about that at the beginning of the podcast, I was like, "Oh, I'm, I think I'm sensing a trend here." Yeah. <laugh> Um, but that's what's really ... I'm so grateful that our customers want to be growth minded and want to be growth oriented and we really view ourselves as an extension of their marketing team or their sales team or their tech team to say like, "Hey, let's collaborate on this together. Like, let's co-create what this can look like. " So we bring our expertise in these digital systems and they bring their expertise and that's really where things, uh, start to shine and the magic happens. 

Jessica Denson (22:50):
Um, I would like to touch on, um, the fact you mentioned that you're in multiple, and you have a diverse set of clients, North America, Europe, Canada, uh, well, North- Canada is pardon North America, but <laugh> it's ... What I, what I'm gonna, what I'm trying to get to is how do you manage delivering consistent results across these diversity of space? Uh, everybody does, especially in the ISP space, everybody does things just a little bit different, um, depending where you're going, even from state to state, not just country to country. 

Hannah Collins (23:24):
Yeah, great question. Um, so it really starts with a f- at the beginning of any, anytime that we're working with a customer, we start with a deep discovery process because, of course, we have, you know, expertise and experience, but you're totally right. Everyone's doing it a little bit differently. And so we spend a lot of time at the beginning of any engagement really getting to understand what's the current systems, what are the current processes, what are the current pain points before making any types of recommendations, um, because otherwise, you know, it's, it's just happening in a vacuum and it's gonna be square peg round hole. So that discovery process is huge. Also, you know, building that trust between us and the clients so that when we do come in and make recommendations, they're like, "Okay, yeah, these people really get me. " Like that's the goal at the end of this discovery process.

(24:21)
People are like, "Ugh, I feel like you understand our business." And we're like, "Yes, perfect." So a lot of that comes with, honestly, our team, we spend a lot of time training on how to ask good questions, how to be a good listener, how to listen for the problem underneath the problem, um, because that's more of, of what it is. And then from there, you can diagnose and deliver consistently, but if you don't understand the problem in the first place or, you know, the nuances to those problems, things go off the ra- rails really quickly and you, you know, you can't see my hands right now, but every slight deviation starts to get farther and farther and farther apart. And then next thing you know, you're like, "Hey, we're, we've really missed the mark here." So our goal is being really good and consistent at being good question askers and good listeners.

(25:12)
And then we have a lot of templates, automations. We, we are doing our own, you know, revenue operations within ourselves to be able to control the quality of the output, um, and make sure that that's consistent. 

Jessica Denson (25:27):
Makes sense. Again, you're going back to that foundation that you were talking about earlier and finding- Yeah. ... those pieces, yeah. Um, so second mile, y- you're not just a tech-savvy consulting company. <laugh> You're also shaping what modern people- centered work can look like. And I say that because your company operates as a fully remote global workforce, and you've, you've been doing that for a while, so why was that important? 

Hannah Collins (25:55):
Yeah. I'm ... There are so many talented people out there, and being able to connect with those talented people and get that diversity of background, experience, language, culture, location, gender, all of that is just super important to us because all of our customers look so different. Like you just said, you know, there's nuances. Um, and so to be able to have a team that also, you know, has a lot of different backgrounds and experiences and therefore can, um, connect, I really think that diversity breeds innovation and helps us move forward faster, um, than the other way around. So yeah, we've got, um, we've got folks all over. We, we decided to really embrace the digital system and, and, you know, have this remote first mindset since the very beginning. Um, we've always had, uh, a remote first mindset, um, and so that has ... It wasn't, you know, crazy to us when, when COVID happened and everyone had to go online.

(27:05)
If anything, um, we were, like, talking to other, you know, people in our space or able to say, like, "Hey, we've, we've done this for a while now." Um, happy to share any tips or tricks or our experiences, um, because, yeah, it definitely is a different approach, but one that allows us to be able to interact with people that, that we just wouldn't be able to, um, connect with in, if we were in one place and, and one time and, and wanting things to look one certain way. 

Jessica Denson (27:35):
And I can imagine when the pandemic hit, you, you guys were already ready for that in some sense because you have this remote team. 

Hannah Collins (27:44):
Exactly. Yeah. We did have, um, we had a pretty strong, or not strong, but I would say for a while we were half in person, half remote. Mm-hmm. Um, and then to be, to be totally honest, it started to kind of feel a little bifurcated. Mm-hmm. We were like, "Hey, wait a second, you know, how do we make sure that everyone, right, like diversity and inclusion, so how do we make sure that everyone feels, you know, connected to the team?" And so we did decide to go, um, totally remote and it was an adjustment for sure. Like building remote culture is tough. Um, but we still get together in person because I think there's so much value to that. Um, so we've committed to, you know, these team experiences in person and really making sure that the main goal when we're doing that is time together and just hanging out and, and getting to be with each other and building, um, experiences, doing a lot of continuing education and learning and development.

(28:41)
But yeah, building a remote culture and remote team, it's just, it's different. Um, you, you can't lean on those quote unquote coffee break, water cooler 

Jessica Denson (28:50):
Coffee- 

Hannah Collins (28:51):
Yeah. ... like, like you could in the past. 

Jessica Denson (28:53):
Mm-hmm. Yeah. I, I work, I went from working in newsrooms to working for Connect to Nation, which is totally remote. <laugh> It was quite the adjustment for me, but the, it's a great, it's a great company. I love working for, for it. We do a lot of good stuff in the nonprofit, we're nonprofits, so we do a lot of good things. But, uh, it's, it is an adjustment. It definitely is. So, uh, also, one of the ... So cue everybody putting in their resumes to Hannah at the next thing I'm gonna say, because one of the most forward thinking moves you made was implementing a four-day work week. Um, you received local recognition, people were pretty excited about it. So talk about why you did that and how it's transformed your team. 

Hannah Collins (29:33):
The four-day work week, we are big fans, obviously, for exactly what you just said, of cue up the resumes. Um, uh, we get really, really talented people who wanna come to work here, and I'm so thankful for that, um, especially right now. Um, it's, you know, when people are like, "Oh, it's so hard to find good people, " I wanna be like, "Have you tried a four-day work week?" <laugh> Um, because Because yeah, it's, um, it's really amazing in terms of, you know, talent acquisition and retention. In our industry, we have people who have worked for us for quite some time. We have a, um, we had people who worked for us for seven years, right? Um, and so that's just, uh, really humbling. And I'm, I credit a lot of that. We started our, our four-day work week journey in 2019. Um, but also, like, we, we've gotta practice what we preach, right?

(30:32)
Like, we talk about being more efficient, being more effective, and the four-day work week forces that. Like, you have to prioritize your time, you have to learn how to automate things, and also how to say no to things that are just outside of, of our expertise or outside of what's really gonna provide the most value to the customer. We have to really protect that time. Um, but I would say, you know, things like AI, things like automation and integration, like, that is, you know, the four-day work week really has the potential to be more accessible to people easier than ever because of, of what's happening from a technology space. So, you know, for when people are like, "Oh, I don't know if we could do that, " I would say we have been more productive, more profitable, had better, um, you know, over the, the course of our business have had better retention and talent.

(31:29)
Um, and so, of course, there are some constraints and, and some limitations that we are very actively always having to solve through and, and think through. But yeah, the four-day work week, big fan, I would say the time is right. I could go off on a whole tangent- <laugh> ... Historically about how the time is right, but, and if you wanna look at my LinkedIn or we can have a conversation about it, like, right now is a great time to be thinking about a four-day work week. 

Jessica Denson (31:57):
And you have a, what, what makes the timing so special? 

Hannah Collins (32:01):
The timing is really special because it, it, the five-day workweek was introduced 100 years ago. It's only been 100 years of working a five-day work week. Oh. And it was in, um, you know, coming off of a, uh, off of the industrial revolution, coming off of a pandemic, coming off of, you know, employees saying, "Hey, we need, you know, better work-life balance." And Henry Ford introdu- was one of the first major businesses to introduce the five-day work week and people were like, "This will never work." And now that's the standard. And so, yeah, 100 years later, like, the way we work cha- has changed drastically. Like, you and I were just talking about we work from home- mm-hmm. ... we work from these tiny computers now. And so if the way we work has changed and how we work, why hasn't when we work changed?

(32:54)
And, you know, thinking through, "Hey, we are coming off of an internet and a digital revolution and a pandemic and people saying, Hey, you know, the demands of my life are, are increasing, I really think now is a great time to introduce that four-day work week. 

Jessica Denson (33:10):
I love it. I also think just, you know, when you were talking about the different benefits of it is the, that you have to problem solve in a different way. You know, even just your time, you have to think, okay, what can I do to make this happen and protect this space? <laugh> Uh, there, there's a lot of motivation in that. <laugh> I'm just saying. So, uh, you know- Yeah, 

Hannah Collins (33:31):
Exactly. Like, if you have two weeks to pack for a trip or you have two hours- 

Jessica Denson (33:35):
Right. ... 

Hannah Collins (33:36):
Guess what? You're still gonna go on that trip and you're still gonna put the exact same amount of things into that suitcase and you've gotta be really thoughtful and really strategic about it, but you're not gonna miss out on that trip because you only have two hours to pack. Right. Yeah. That's kind of the, the very, very, very, um, high level analogy to use there. But yeah, you're right. It's ... We can't just throw ... We, we can't just throw time at things. Um, and we really are viewing input does not equal output. So- Mm. ... you can, you can have output in a totally different, meaningful and impactful way now using technology and creating the right systems and processes around how that happens. 

Jessica Denson (34:19):
Well, I'm a fan of the idea, so I wanna make sure my CEO, he doesn't miss this episode. <laugh> 

Hannah Collins (34:24):
Yeah. Yeah. You can, you can cut this snippet and be like, "Hey, can you, can you fact check this? Can you do some, some audio, um, QA just on this, this one part right here?" <laugh> 

Jessica Denson (34:34):
This one little part, that's all I need you to hear. Oh, that's funny. Um, you know, I know we mentioned ISPs and I don't even think we, we have, we didn't talk about this much even in our pre-interview, but talk about some of the other industries you help. Um, I don't wanna, to, to let you go today without, like, at least letting you touch on those, the education and the other things that you guys work in. 

Hannah Collins (34:56):
Yeah. So we also work in, um, with a lot of higher ed institutions, um, and, and education. Um, the University of Tennessee is, is one of our clients. We've gotten to be a part of their digital transformation at the university. And how cool as a graduate and an, an alumni UT, we, we got to be a part of, um, building the new admissions website. And I'm like, I remember applying to UT- Oh, wow. ... transfer student, but now it's so cool to see our team, um, worked with the admissions team to build the new admissions website. And so, yeah, it's really special to be able to work with,

(35:38)
Um, our, uh, my, my university. We've got a few other UT grads on the team, so that's really special. But, and we've, we work with a few other higher ed folks too. So, yeah, seeing how, um, technologies is changing, not just, you know, how students are coming to university, but, you know, how, um, technology is changing their university experience, you know, once they're on campus too is really special. So making sure that, um, the university's, you know, digital footprint matches up with what those students have from an expectation perspective is something that, um, we, we get to spend a lot of time and energy, uh, diving into. And it's been really fun getting to work with some of these growth-minded universities that are like, "Hey, we want to meet students where they're at and, and provide a great digital experience for them." 

Jessica Denson (36:33):
That's fantastic. What do you think on the ISP side, heading back there, do you, do you think are some innovations that we're gonna see in the coming years or things that you think are exciting that are on the horizon? 

Hannah Collins (36:47):
Ooh, great question. I think that, of course, AI, um, is going to really be impactful with, um, with ISPs. Part of it is the ability and how to service customers. Um, I think is, uh, AI has a lot of potential there, but also really being able to better understand what those customers are looking for and wanting and needing out of the internet. Um, I also think a lot of our ISPs are obviously involved with, you know, things like how do we bring digital transformation, including AI, so things like data centers and, and making sure that we're able to support that from an infrastructure perspective. Um, I would say those are some of the places that I'm really interested to see where things go. Um, but yeah, from a, from an AI perspective, being able to, right, we were just talking about this. Hey, when the internet is down, your life kind of goes on pause. <laugh>

(37:49)
And so, right? For better or for worse, um, and as much as we would love to have an internet snow day and not have to use the internet, it really powers so much of what we do. And so being able to, for example, like use something like, um, Agentic AI to, you know, self-serve and self-diagnose your internet issues, um, has a, a lot of potential. That's just like one kind of easy thing to think of there. But yeah, if you could use some type of chatbot or even, you know, upload a, a video of what's happening with your router and be able to get, you know, instant feedback that is accurate and, and helps move you forward, I think is gonna be a great use of AI, for example. Oh, 

Jessica Denson (38:33):

Those are, those are great ideas just off the top of your head there. <laugh> Well, uh, second mile, as we discussed earlier, is you're founded by you and your, your, your, uh, partner, Jess. Um, it's something that's too rare in tech and operation space having women leading these types of companies. So I, I can't let you go without asking how, uh, i- is there any advice you'd give other women who wanna enter this mission-driven tech space and/or has it affected how do you think you guys run comp- you, as two women run the company differently than maybe male leadership might? <laugh> That's, I know it's a heavy, those are heavy questions, but- Yeah. ... love to rethink. 

Hannah Collins (39:16):
<laugh> No, that is a great question. I, it's one of those things where I'm, I'm so used to it now. 

Jessica Denson (39:24):
Um- Oh, I bet. Yeah. 

Hannah Collins (39:26):
And, but, but you're right, like, not taking it for granted. Um, a lot of our counterparts in this space are male, um, and I really view it as an opportunity to, um, use it as, like, our, our superpower. So because it's different, because it is, is 

Jessica Denson (39:45):
Unique 

Hannah Collins (39:45):
And, um, we can, um ... I think that has been one of the things that really has helped us drive work-life balance, um, is, like, the ability for people on our team to spend time with their families, to, you know, hey, if the kids are sick, you know, you can spend time with them on a Wednesday knowing, "Hey, if I need to, I have Fridays kind of this buffer zone." Um, so I would say female leadership has helped us focus on developing the whole person and, and who they are inside of work and who they are outside of work, um, because, like, as a boss to think that I'm just getting the person that's logging on today, that's not true, right? Like, we really do ... You, you kind of have to check your personal life at the front door, but what's happening in your personal life affects your work output.

(40:39)
And so being cognizant and mindful of that and trying to create a space where people can do their best work because of how we try to support them outside of work with, you know, parental leave for, for male employees and female employees, um, and, and making sure that people have the ability to be more flexible with their work. Um, yeah, those are, are some things that I think maybe are unique about female leadership. Um, and I would say the, the empathy aspect of how we show up at work has served us well, um, in female leadership. So yeah, I think those are two things that come to mind, but you could ask our employees. Maybe they would, uh, have better insight into it. <laugh> 

Jessica Denson (41:23):
Well, I, I think it's wonderful. And you guys are at 10, you're both, you're both at 10 years, I mean, in the company, so it's, that's, that's pretty incredible that you founded that together and it's still going. A lot of first-time bus- you know, businesses like that, or new businesses like that don't make it to 10 years, so that's pretty incredible. So Bravo. Um, having said that, or Brava, do I say Brava when it's a female? <laugh> 

Hannah Collins (41:46):
Maybe, maybe. Yeah, no, we're so 

Jessica Denson (41:48):
Thankful. We gotta take Italian. <laugh> Yeah, 

Hannah Collins (41:50):
Thank you. 

Jessica Denson (41:50):
Um, uh, so, uh, before I let you go, I just wanna get a final takeaway. What would you like people to remember about our conversation about Second Mile, um, ISPs and spec- specifically, but it doesn't have to be that. Um, what do, what do you hope people take away from our conversation? 

Hannah Collins (42:08):
Ooh, that's a good one. I really hope that people take away from the conversation that digital transformation doesn't have to be this big, audacious, scary thing. Like, it can really start small and, and thinking about, yeah, people process platform, um, that would be my hope, especially, you know, we've, we've talked to so many ISPs that are like, "Oh, you know, I want to be able to send this marketing lead nurture without having to manually upload these lists and stuff like that. " And I'm, we're like, "Okay, hey, let's help you think through the next best step, the next best win instead of, you know, trying to eat this whole thing at the same time." Um, so that would be my hope is that people think about ... And, and maybe the same thing when it comes to a four-day work week of, uh ... I can't just start a four-day work week, like our started with a, um, half days on Fridays in the summer, right?

(43:09)
Like all of 

Jessica Denson (43:09):
This 

Hannah Collins (43:11):
Is an evolution and, you know, step by step, um, so maybe that would be my, my thing that I would hope people can take away is like with the right people, some of these big, complex problems are very achievable and don't have to be so scary. So yeah, whether it's us, you know, helping our ISPs problem solve or, um, you know, the, the, our team, you know, coming together and being like, "Hey, how do we fix X, Y, and Z within our own processes and, and use technology to do that? " Um, a lot of that happens in, in a trial and error, baby step, step by step, continuous improvement type of format.

Jessica Denson (43:53):
Well, that is fantastic place to leave it. So thank you so much, Hannah. I've really enjoyed talking you t- talking with you today. I appreciate it. Um, I'd love to have you on down the road as new things come out from you guys, you wanna share some more information or anything that's going on, I'd love to, to do a follow-up down the road. 

Hannah Collins (44:11):
Awesome. Cool. Thanks, Jessica. I'm glad we got to, uh, to connect. <laugh> 

Jessica Denson (44:15):
We finally got to talk <laugh>- Yeah. ... after some, some, uh, false starts there. Uh, again, we- 

Hannah Collins (44:21):
Weird using Connect with Connected Nation. I'm like, okay, you know, do I use a different word? But it feels very appropriate in this 

Jessica Denson (44:28):
Set. But yeah, <laugh> it is. Uh, again, we've been talking with Hannah Collins, the co-founder and vice president of growth for Second Mile. I'll include links to the company website, Hannah's LinkedIn, so you can ask her about her ideas <laugh> on four day workweek and remote work and additional resources in the description of this podcast. I'm Jessica Denson. Thanks for listening to Connect to Nation. If you like our show and wanna know more about us, head to connectonation.org or find our latest episodes on iTunes, iHeartRadio, Google Podcast, Pandora, or Spotify.